Asking as there has been a few comments mentioning this with the new !stardewvalley@lemm.ee taking over !stardewvalley@lemmy.ml
!yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com for additional context on those recent events if you are interested
Also, an older post for more context on how lemmy.ml is managed: https://lemmy.world/post/16211417
Curious to hear other thoughts about this, as I’m trying to keep !simracing@lemmy.ml active, but might suggest to move it elsewhere if a lot of people prefer not to interact with lemmy.ml communities
Sometimes. The only people more insufferable than .world libs are .ml “leftists”.
Personally, I don’t. I get from your story that you seem to have been abusively banned, and from the comments that it doesn’t seem like an isolate case. But while that might deter me from making an account there, or at most from having a community hosted there, it’s not like anything bad comes to me from merely interacting with .ml content. The only servers worth blocking in my opinion are those full of spammers, or of content I’d personally hate to see in any situation.
Interestingly enough, I don’t really have issues with lemmy.ml myself
I never brought up political topics on any of their communities, so I am fine until now
I prefer to support smaller instances, but don’t have a problem with lemmy.ml specifically (whereas I do sometimes go out of my way to avoid lemmy.world)
I see more content complaining about .ml than I see content on .ml worth complaining about.
I generally don’t block instances, communities, or users, either. I just know I am capable of recognizing a shit take on politics anywhere and can move on without existential or social crisis.
I only block communities. I don’t want to see half of conversations, and haven’t encountered a whole server where they refuse to admin properly.
I just know I am capable of recognizing a shit take on politics anywhere
Not when the “shit take” in question is the arbitrary, capricious, unjustified removal of thoughtful, insightful, accurate, reasonable posts and comments. You (generally) can’t recognize the “shit take” of removing good content unless you spend all day reading the mod logs.
No, but I can almost always check the modlog when a user complains about how their thoughtful, insightful, accurate, and reasonable post or comment was arbitrarily, capriciously, and unjustly removed.
And that comparison rarely disappoints.
No, but I can almost always check the modlog
whenif a user complainsFTFY.
The authors of thoughtful, insightful, accurate, and reasonable posts and comments tend to be the kind of people who choose their battles, and quietly walk away from communities led by power-tripping dipshits.
Very well articulated!:-)
That’s bc you are an established user who knows their way around how to use Lemmy. Perhaps you even use Arch btw? (/s, but only partway, bc those of who enjoy the customizability of Linux really are a breed apart from the mainstream, in terms of our value judgements in particular)
However new users to Lemmy find it very off-putting. Also, people in the USA are touchy, watching our democracy crumble before our very eyes - there is something like a 50% chance that it won’t survive even though the next year, regardless of who wins, but if it does, then we’ll simply repeat all of this again in the next one, and so on. So for those of us who watched e.g. Innuendo Studios’ The Alt Right Playbook, to now see those identical patterns of behaviors on display (by “tankies” or whoever), is more than a little disconcerting.
And tbf, the likes of lemmy.ml is nothing at all on the scale of Lemmygrad.ml and hexbear.net. So if you want to remain federated with some or all of those, then power to you and I am very glad that you can enjoy your time on the Fediverse.
However, not all of us are in the same boat and some of us would rather only see the half of the conversation that we don’t have to mentally parse and decode what it means before we throw it away. Without having to block hundreds of individual trolls I mean. Ofc we are prevented from doing so since user level defederation does not exist, and the only instance I’ve ever even so much as heard of that blocks all of the big 3 is Lemmy.cafe. So rather than wait for Sublinks/PieFed/Mbin to improve, perhaps I should move there?
Maybe this is all intellectual laziness? I dunno, I truly don’t, but also I don’t see the harm in allowing people to have their preferences met?
some of us would rather only see the half of the conversation
Well I guess the only thing I could possibly say to that woul–
Hehe, way to be a part of the chang–
Not exclusively, but I do think twice before posting to a community hosted there, and actively seek out alternatives if possible. The only two I haven’t found alternatives for are c/crows and c/freecad.
crows
There’s !corvids@sopuli.xyz, but it doesn’t have much activity.
Absolutely.
I watch closely though.
Edit: Judging by my history, I missed it a couple times and participated
Of course.
They banned me for calling Russia imperialist in one of their rant post, and claiming NATO was necessary because countries keep invading their neighbors.
Meanwhile the Hexbear users saying that “crackers” should be murdered are welcome to continue their discussions on .ml.
Same, but Gyna.
Our based opinions aren’t allowed over there. You have to bend left until your view is broken.
I mean really you’re bending upward to authoritarian on the compass
< looks around at Western countries with militarized police forces, brutal suppression of protest, and high incarceration rates >
“This is fine. Tankies are authoritarian.”
If something is bad, then all its adversaries are good and can do no wrong.
Lemmy is already fairly left. ML is tankie from what I understand, so that would not be further left but upward, right? I hope you didn’t get the impression I’m a fan of prison slave labor and western imperialism. Many things can be and are bad at once
I block subs and users and that usually takes care of 99% of the bullshit
Do you do it individually, or use like an app or something? Bc the Lemmy instance block does very little - only blocking communities but not users from that instance.
PieFed btw allows user blocking of any custom instance you want though:-) - I just switched to it today and think I am going to be happier here. It’s not quite as polished as Lemmy, but on the other hand I don’t see true user-level blocking ever being added to Lemmy no matter how long the wait. So I decided that I was tired of wading through the garbage rooting for treasure, and just decided to block it all.
I’m on boost so maybe its just client side. Tbh i don’t know much about how lemmy functions under the hood. It’s been fun tho
Yeah it’s probably client-side. Boost… that’s good to know, thanks!:-)
No. I self-censor a bit there, and prefer other instances so I don’t have to, though.
I’ve blocked the instance entirely. I never see posts from their communities, though I am surprised to still see users from it. I thought it would block everything.
Pasting from another comment in this thread:
The only way I know how to ditch the users, besides blocking each one individually, would be to make a new account on either dubvee.org or Lemmy.cafe where all 3 of the big 3 are completely defederated. Think of those instances as troll-blockers, working hard to keep the Fediverse pleasant to converse in:-).
lol
Dubvee is even worse than .ml for the censorship stuff. The admin banned a ton of people that never even knew of its existence until we all got spammed by his automod bot duplicating the instance wide ban to each and every individual community.
What!? How is that even possible…? Are you sure this was dubvee.org and not the Santabot, or are you saying this is the guy that did that? Bc I remember the Santabot and railed hard against it, but I think the Admiral Patrick guy just preemptively defederated from lemmy.ml, which wouldn’t send out a notification (I would hope) to literally everyone on that instance? That would be… shit, no bueno.
Another place that spams people with modlog entries is lemmy.ml itself - the admins there ban someone from every single community across the entire instance, even ones that they have never heard of.
Hey, can you send me a message to read more about the dubvee.org situation? I was just starting to seriously consider joining it, and over the last hour have recommended it to several people since it is one of only two total instances that has dared to defederate entirely from lemmy.ml. If the situation is insane then I should not do that, but what you are describing sounds awfully familiar, twice over even, yet with different causes, so I wonder if one of those is the explanation. At least, I am quite interested to learn more!?:-)
Well, I’m here and I don’t know what you all are talking about. And this is sincere, truly don’t understand what’s the issue, could you point me to some of these controversial situations/discussions/measures?
I have a feeling that, if you ask for any specific instance, you’ll get people complaining and blocking that instance for their own reasons. So, I’d let my users decide whether they block or not a user or a whole instance. For example, I don’t like some of the communities in lemmy.world and I complain about it because it just feels the same as being in reddit, but having access to a different point of view is very valuable to me, so I don’t block them.
I also have to add that I use lemmy with the voting system completely disabled. I hate the voting system because it shapes people’s opinions to fit in some specific communities. This is why I think blocking instances should only be used as a last resort against things like blatant spam, boycotting, CP, hate speech and the likes.
.ml is kind of Hexbear or Lemmygrad-lite. On occasion when they notice, they’ll ban you for criticising places like North Korea. I got it once for saying Dengism isn’t socialist.
I still use it, because it’s mostly normal, and “we’re secretly the bad guys” isn’t a very dangerous conspiracy theory.
https://lemmy.ml/post/21552785?scrollToComments=true
As mentioned in the OP: https://lemmy.world/post/16211417
Ah, I see. Well, I had a discussion in that thread too and it felt off at some point. I replied about a similar crime backed by the CIA and some people accused me of whataboutism, while the other guy assumed I was denying the Tiananmen Square massacre. That was not the case.
I used to participate in a subreddit where a permanent set of people, including moderators, would downvote you to oblivion as soon as they read a divergent opinion, though, the subreddit wasn’t about a specific ideology. It wasn’t about arguments, it was systemic. They would eventually ban you if you insisted on your points of view. Both things are shitty, in my opinion, and while one is more permanent than the other, the banning felt at least more straightforward to me.
What I find excessive is the instance ban.
Not all instances should defederate from lemmy.ml. However, it is an issue that everyone commenting on every post across every community on that whole entire instance must essentially conform to all of their ideals - or else be banned from all of those communities, not merely the one with the “offensive” statement. You cannot say anything truthful about Russia, China, Ukraine, Uyghurs, Taiwan, Israel, Palestine, Gaza, etc.
Imagine if we were on Reddit and could not say “fuck spez”, or we were on Linux but for some reason were still forbidden to say “I prefer not to use Windows today, so thank you but no thanks”. Those communities on Lemmy.ml are held hostage to people if not agreeing then at least going along with whatever party line BS that the admins want to uphold. Moreover, at any time they could add whatever their wanted to that list.
Perhaps there will come out a fantastic Linux distro that would revolutionize Linux accessibility - but if they say no, then nobody can access any of the communities there unless they (at the very least tacitly) agree to not so much as mention its name, or that it exists, or anything else about it. This is a hypothetical but I hope you also see the connection to irl: it doesn’t matter what those admins are banning people for, it matters that they have set themselves up as the arbiters of “truth(iness)”, and decide what can or cannot be discussed in their platform. Regardless of which community it is in.
Most of us came here to get away from such, only to find that it is here as well.
Do as you please, but I hope this helps explain just some (and this probably isn’t even fully half of it yet!?!?) of why people are judging the instance. Over time, more and more communities will move off of the instance - the main reason it hasn’t happened yet I think is that version 0.19.3 (iirc?) promised to allow user blocking, which people see now how weak it is plus with 0.19.4-5 it actively got even weaker. Only defederation is left to even consider. Which won’t happen quickly, but e.g. dubvee.org and lemmy.cafe both have already done so, and I imagine others will follow suit before too awfully long, with the amount of vehemence people feel about the situation.
This was pretty informative, thank you. As I said, these instance-bans are just too much, so I mostly agree with your point of view. Would like to read what these admins have to say about the situation.
They have said things like they ban “agitators” and “misinformation”. They do not provide a listing of what those things are. I recall one story from someone who has actual Uyghur family members living with them and they were describing the genocidal practices that they escaped from - BAM, banned.
Facts are political these days, I suppose. Most people don’t get to choose which set of facts they have to live out, day by day.
But obviously the admins are not insane - from their POV, they are doing the rational thing, of protecting their userbase from “misinformation”. Well, keep your ears open I suppose, and you’ll learn more. Hopefully you don’t get banned yourself as a result, but you may want to have a backup plan just in case.
I block politics subs and have never had an issue with lemmy.ml. All the issues I see are related to politics.
Nah, IDGAF about it one way or another. You run into more jerks there than average, but that’s about it, so as long as block lists function, it’s all good
Previously no. Now yes. Apparently got banned for inciting ‘peril’ against my own race because tankies don’t know the difference between ethnically Chinese and of Chinese nationality, and apparently you can’t criticize china in the forums. Throw in a few abusive individuals from the same instance shooting off the mouth and I pretty much said fuck it, I’m out.
Yes, I block lemmy.ml communities when I notice them, just because I don’t want to accidentally contribute anything to that instance. Some of the users are okay, but the admins are not.
