So, uh… You gonna trade me a better machine for my current one, Microsoft?
M$: best I can do is Intel celery, but it’s new enough to run windows 11
sigh does it at least come with ranch or peanutbutter? Celery is better with one of those.
Peanut butter and raisins, gotta get those ants on a log.
Childhood memories
Comes with 64gb emmc & 4gb ram, soldered. Everything else is extra
TRIGGERED
I can’t recall ever trying it with peanut butter, that sounds interesting
deleted by creator
Celery and peanut butter together are the best if you like both of those things separately
Celery is excellent that way. A peanut butter lover’s dream
Celery stalks with peanut butter and raisins is the bomb!
No! CheezWiz with raisins or nothing! Just like my mother used to make.
No, but you can use it for your bloody mary.
Ok, write me a check for a new one.
I will take your windows 10 PC and give you a keychain made of DDR2 RAM in trade.
When will Commerce Secretary Sputnik shill for Windows 11 on Fox?
I switched to Linux on my laptops years ago. Recently, I retired and started playing video games like Skyrim. I play on a Nintendo Switch. I considered playing Skyrim on a laptop so I could use/build mods. I bought a laptop with Windows 11 and spent forty minutes removing the bloat, ads, spyware, ai nonsense, and other dross, fixing it so it did not ‘update’ to restore everything I deleted, and installing my preferred alternatives (browser, search, email etc). It reminded me why I hate Windows almost as much as Mac OS (which is even more controlling). Microsoft have hundreds of engineers ‘enshitifying’ everything. It is more than a full-time job trying to stop them and block their ‘improvements’. I am retired. I have better things to do.
I did not enjoy playing games with a laptop (hurts my arthritis, I prefer using a console and an easy chair) and resented having to reverse engineer everything I installed to keep it running but without sacrificing my privacy so the laptop now just sits in a drawer. It amazes me that anyone still tolerates Microsoft products, or any of the monopolists stuff. Why is anyone still using google search or chrome browser, why bing or any of it? Why is anyone still seeing adverts? Why is everyone still being fed by algorithms? You must chose this - but why? I always sought out better and if it did not exist, I built it, and if I could not build it, I did without. There is a lot of dumbing-down around technology. Back in C20th, we used to build our own hardware, write our own software. We were skilled hobbyists (later I got an M.Sc. to reinforce my hobby skills with theory and even ran a business for a while as an engineer). Around 2000 +/- five years, the monopolists offered ‘help’ in the form of WYSIWYG editors to write code for us or ‘click buttons to register your account’ platforms to host content for us instead of us running our own websites (blogger, wordpress, facebook, twitter etc). They dumbed us all down, farmed us like animals for data and used clickbait to get ad revenue and undermined our politics, culture, even changed our sense of being human. Now old folk can build resources but younger people can only consume. We have to re-skill and resist the seduction of the easy and free-to-use. There’s no such thing as a free lunch. Never trust a tech bro, whether USA or any nationality.
Personally, I want to ‘jail break’ my Switch and make mods for my console version of Skyrim. I can’t do that now as it is illegal but when they bring out the Switch 2 and the old console is ‘obsolete’ and they stop trying to get money for Skyrim, I reckon we tinkerers will get a chance to re-purpose the old console to play the old games in our own way. I reckon some exciting engineering is happening amongst the recyclers and re-purposers rather than amongst the corporates. I only buy second-hand for ethical reasons and to save money. I always install my own software based on AOSP or use a more ethical distro or alternative to the commercial options. I always debloat or degoogle or remove unwanted stuff. I wish that kind of personalisation were more common. There is a zero sum relationship with tech: either the technology controls you, or you control it. I urge you to control your own tech. Don’t be enslaved by it. I feel I am in a minority in wanting sovereignty over my damn phone. It makes me sad.
Personally, I want to ‘jail break’ my Switch and make mods for my console version of Skyrim.
Why not just get a steam deck?
I tried creating a Steam account and was blocked by the revolving captcha security thing - took days to try to get help from their customer care and by the time they got back to me I had lost interest. I spent the waitjng time researching Valve and I decided they are not an ethical business. Made me sad as I loved the idea of a customised-for-gaming-on-console linux OS and liked the look of the hardware. But Valve is a monopolist and has too much market share and too many users and thus too much power - USA politics today shows how big a risk that is. Valve supports unethical business models like ‘rent game to play’, AI-generated junk games and IP violations so it debases game development and hurts indy developers, live-streaming games which is bad for environment. It promotes ‘easy access/always on gaming’ and is thus profiting from addiction-to-gaming, which ix a MASSIVE problem and few gamers admit it. It’s an American corporation and I distrust American corporate culture. Most of which might be said of other console/platforms so its not just Valve/Steam, I feel wary of but the whole industry. I bought a second-hand Switch so did not help Nintendo/Japanese corporate power directly. I bought a bundle of 2nd-hand games on sd card with minimal download content (except for ‘No Man’s Sky’ which constantly updates). I am trying to be an ethical gamer - limit my time gaming to stop me becoming an addict etc. But I admit I am compromised - I spend too much time gaming, being retired its easy to lose track of time. Honestly, I feel like a vegan who wraps bacon in thick wholemeal sandwiches and pretends they are not really eating pigs since its mainly bread. I am ‘a work in progress’.
The form factor of switch/steam deck is expanding, valve doesn’t by any means have a stranglehold over it, they are by far the biggest player but the benefits to linux gaming are shared across the board which opens up the entire industry not closes it down?
Not saying I trust Valve or think they are somehow a company but good but yeah out of the current options I will happily give Valve my money.
But I admit I am compromised - I spend too much time gaming, being retired its easy to lose track of time. Honestly, I feel like a vegan who wraps bacon in thick wholemeal sandwiches and pretends they are not really eating pigs since its mainly bread.
Fuck that noise, play video games, they expand and stimulate your mind and you don’t hurt anyone or waste any significant amount of resources playing them!
You make fair comment. I don’t disagree with 99% of what you say. However, I stand by my words about addiction. I agree gaming is potentially a very benign thing and I get a lot of pleasure from gaming but I still want to red flag some aspects of it where addiction does seem to be a factor. Being addicted to gaming has led to health problems for players e.g. repetitive strain injuries or tendonitis - it has adversely affected my health, made my arthritis worse, caused tendonitis so I have had to cut back etc. In extreme cases, addicted gamers have murdered their own babies or been violent to partners because they were distracted by them while playing, lost their temper, and lashed out. And getting players addicted is obviously potentially profitable but making profit from addiction is evil. I say ‘responsible gaming’ needs to be the uncompromising rule just like with anything else that can be addictive or mood-altering or get under our skins the way a well-made game can.
Valve isn’t like most USA corporations, they’re private and generally a lot better.
As an indie developer, Valve has helped me a lot. I have my game on Switch, Xbox One, Epic, and Steam, and Steam is by far the most revenue, and was the first platform that accepted my game. They make it so easy for indie devs to ship games - yeah the downside is they get a lot of low effort submissions, but the user rating system takes care of that (mostly). And they’re adding more warnings for gamers about what games have AI generated content/art.
blocked by the revolving captcha security thing
I’ve seen this happen for people behind VPNs or using public access points (coffee shops, schools, etc). Valve has to do this to prevent spammers, and the sad part is a lot of real users get hit too. But before they did there was a lot more spam user accounts in the steam forums and messaging users, usually scams. If you still want to create an account and can’t get past the captcha send me a private message and I can help you out with it.
I don’t love Valve, as they’re just a company at the end of the day, but they have done a lot of positive things for Linux gaming and the indie developer scene. Especially for linux graphics drivers.
Cheers, thank you for that info. It’s good to hear from people with lived experience, real knowledge and experience. Yeah, I use a vpn and suspected it was the problem but even after I turned it off, cleared my browser cache etc, the captcha thing was not working. Bit of a mystery still.
I am not fanatical about stuff. I would consider changing my gaming set up - I like playing on a console so I might try a Steamdeck one day, like when my Switch needs replacing. I like the games I play on my Switch - but they are all ported from other platforms and were developed for them. I find most of the games available for Nintendo Switch, i.e. developed for it, totally uninteresting. Not the sort of thing I would ever want to play so in future I would be looking for a less restricted technology and access to more content. Also, I find the Nintendo shop unuseable. I recently looked for a virtual tennis game because I thought it might help me be more active and I used to enjoy tennis. Could not find a decent option - just cartoonish rubbish like some Mario tennis or Pokemon tennis rip-off. I get the impression Switch games are made to exploit children. That is a big ethical violation in my view. So, yeah, its a complex topic and I am still learning my way around.
I never liked Windows 10, I had way too many issues with it. However, so many companies rely on old versions of Windows and it takes them years to upgrade to the latest version. The machines I use at work still have Windows 10 installed because the software we rely on isn’t compatible with Windows 11 yet. This whole “trade in your old PC for a new one” is ridiculous. Thankfully there’s many Linux distros that work with older hardware so you don’t need Windows!
How much could a new PC be Michael, $10?
Just buy a new girlfriend!
Linux
Im going to get so many pc upgrades. woohoo.
Hot take from an IT guy: save your important data, make a plain vanilla W11 boot USB (nothing fancy, no Rufus tricks), wipe your hard drive to zeroes, and install W11 like normal. I’ve reimaged a ton of older PCs and literally never seen it not work. My 10 year old Optiplex, supposedly ineligible for W11, runs W11 just fine.
Microsoft might someday break it, sure. That’s not new. Microsoft products were always, in practice, available to us at Microsoft’s pleasure. This is the same company that allows massgrave to exist on github because they’d rather we pirate MS Office than allow LibreOffice any oxygen. We’ll probably be fine.
Also IT guy. Hot take indeed. I’ve done this but won’t support this. I will almost guarantee some update will break shit at the most inconvenient time humanly possible and the people you’ve done this for will need your help, all at the same time.
I’m using this opportunity to expand Linux market share.
Most people only use a browser these days. People that ask me about Windows 10 eol get pushed towards Linux. There is really no need to spend money to replace a machine mainly used to browse the web.
Only if they need stuff that won’t work on Linux or they really really want Windows to use Chrome or Firefox on for some reason I’ll recommend complying with Microsoft’s hubris.
But not before suggesting Apple sells pretty and user friendly computers as well. Because I really want this to hurt Windows’s market share and by golly I’ll do everything in my power to help.
I will almost guarantee some update will break shit at the most inconvenient time humanly possible and the people you’ve done this for will need your help, all at the same time.
Well, yeah. That’s life as an admin under the best circumstances. There’s a running list of Windows ticking time bombs over on r/sysadmin. There are lots of good reasons to ditch Windows, but I wouldn’t say the risk of MS shutting down technically unsupported hardware is one of them (because I don’t agree it’s a substantial risk).
Well, yeah. That’s life as an admin under the best circumstances.
I don’t disagree, but I don’t see the reason in tempting/inviting work to spawn. Especially in the cases where windows itself is optional.
I also think it’s interesting you’re not convinced it’s a reasonable risk. I’ve had updates break things on clients under my control on several occasions, particularly post Windows 7 with the bigger feature releases.
It’s definitely a “when”, and not an “if” to me.
It’s also worth pointing out Microsoft has already actively been working against allowing you to bypass the requirements. It’s very clear to me they want to go towards some kind of hardware lifecycle management and I would definately not put it past them they deliberately make windows stop working on unsupported platforms at some point.
I’m imagining me doing this to my building of elderly, it dies and then opening my eyes to 40 work orders. Lmao
Why not install Linux for them once Windows 10 is dead?
They are a prime candidate for a dead simple Linux distro with the “Web”, “Mail” and “Documents” shortcuts on the desktop and nothing else. Can’t get a virus, can’t get scammed by fake Microsoft support and most won’t even notice.
I have installed Fedora Kinoite for my mom and have had zero complaints.
It’s on the to do list for sure. Currently getting them off their external antivirus’ is a challenge. They have to come to the conclusion themselves (most of the time)
Most are in their 80s. Think it’ll be next generation honestly. Some dont even have phones or email addresses.
Had one who got a Chromebook and was just at a loss. Tbf that was an ass Chromebook but that was still too much for her.
Most have ollllld computers that are hitting the hardware failure stage. I’ve seen a god damn Vista machine at work.
I’m gonna convert someone. Just finding someone who is aware of what a tab in a browser is a rare occurrence currently lol
Just in case anyone reading doenst know - the free tool Rufus can write a Win 11 ISO to your usb drive md remove all the silly soft requirements.
Or better yet, windows 10 LTSC. Which will be supported for another 2 years. 4 if you subsequently switch the product key to the IOT LTSC version.
oh nice - thanks for sharing, i was not aware of this and will add it to my toolbox!
The hurdles windows users are willing to put up with is nothing less than amazing. That’s not a good thing.
Oh, I already have Linux on my laptop. It’s my desktop that still has some blockers preventing a full Linux transition.
Primarily the Pimax headset. Once I get a suitable replacement, I’ll actually be able to start testing and transferring stuff.Or look at it the other way: they hate Linux so much they’d rather deal with that than deal with Linux.
I would love to learn and deal with Linux, unfortunately the software I need for work only supports Mac or Win
It’s possible you can run it through wine, might be worth a try
Much business oriented software just hasn’t had the work done on it to work on Wine. Really the only reason I have to run Windows now is the 3D CAD software I use and my best option at this point is running it in a Windows VM on my server. And no Freecad and Fusion360 aren’t suitable options, they both suck.
Ouch that’s unfortunate. At least keep your old hardware for personal use Linux when you get new work PC. Get your feet wet with the ecosystems
IOT version is supported until 2032
Windows updates don’t work correctly a lot of the time if you’ve bypassed the requirements. My predecessor at work installed 11 on some ancient systems and it’s been a hassle.
I’ve had no issues on the machines i’ve done this with, aside from having to do an upgrade in place with a major update (used rufus, write the latest iso, did the upgrade from the bootable usb.
regular windows updates work without hassle. perhaps your predecessor didn’t use a complete solution 🤷
Yeah, but will updates work? And even if they do, what’s stopping Microsoft in disabling them somehow?
Nowadays if you want to have usable Windows installation you need to use a bunch of 3rd party scripts that might break on next update. Learning Linux is easier than this shit.
I can’t wait for someone to ask me how to solve some shit in Windows, and me saying that I don’t have patience for this crap.
updates work.
MS won’t disable them - they want people to move to Windows 11.
Congrats on migrating to Linux! it’s what i’ve been pushing friends and family towards for decades, and thankfully Ubuntu is in a position right now to be a fine desktop OS, esp for the average user who lives in a web browser.
I am using Debian stable, since I no longer care about having latest stuff and the whole Debian-like ecosystem is what I am the most familiar with. As for Ubuntu I never had good experience with it, with random crashes all the time last time I used it (about 10-12 years ago), and when I tried it last year, I encountered random crashes in GNOME apps just after finishing setup.
Linux Mint (regular or LMDE) is what I’d probably install on other people computers though. Literally never had problems with it (used it about 10 years ago on a netbook).
sure sounds like you have some funny hardware configurations with all these issues you have across OSes.
👍
The free OS Linux also doesn’t pull this crap, and Rufus can write a Linux ISO to your USB drive and remove Microsoft’s gaslighting from your life.
gaslighting
Bro, i cut my teeth on FreeBSD 2.2.x and served in the Great Linux / Windows wars of 95 and 98…
but im not so sure MS ever gaslit anyone. everyone seemed to have a pretty solid perception of reality.
Maybe the term gaslighting means something new to you 🤷
I use it in the sense that Microsoft is changing what you perceive to be ownership. They’re essentially gaslighting you into believing that they actually own your PC, and that you need to upgrade to be compatible with Windows, instead of Windows being compatible with your hardware.
I use it in the sense
right, like i figured, you’ve got your own definition 👍
They’re essentially gaslighting you into believing that they actually own your PC
can you share some examples of this behavior?
Here’s the definition I see:
psychological manipulation of a person usually over an extended period of time that causes the victim to question the validity of their own thoughts, perception of reality, or memories and typically leads to confusion, loss of confidence and self-esteem, uncertainty of one’s emotional or mental stability, and a dependency on the perpetrator
My use is a bit hyperbolic, sure, but it’s in the same vein.
Microsoft has slowly been taking more control:
- Microsoft Store w/ UWP apps - attempt at lock-in
- secure boot - makes some sense kn corporate devices, little sense on consumer devices and just forced Linux distros to scramble to support it
- Windows login - first optional, then default, then you need a workaround to avoid it
- Windows 11 essentially forcing a hardware upgrade, not for performance reasons, but “lock-in” reasons (need TPM because… security?)
They’re really trying to take the “personal” out of “personal computer,” all in the name of “security,” implying that other approaches are “insecure.”
In other words, they’re trying to alter what we see as “reality” when it comes to control over our own devices.
My use is a bit hyperbolic
it really is, across the board.
It’s not 1998 anymore. No one cares about the desktop anymore as long as you can run Firefox.
I absolutely care, but maybe that’s because I’m a developer by trade.
It’s one new PC, Michael. How much could it cost? $10?
based on the context of the show shed say like 10,000$ but I like yours better lol
What’s 10 dollars? The people saying this are too rich to understand poor numbers. They probably think in terms of “a new pc costs less than an hour at my favorite spa, people are complaining too much”.
It’s a joke from a tv show. The rich out of touch lady thinks bananas “only cost” ten dollars.
Theres always money in the banana stand!
Ahead of its time, predicting the consequences of tariffs like that.
Arrested Development tv show. Pretty funny. The family fortune started with the dad opening a banana stand in his youth.
ALT: 2 panels. 1st panel- Rich mom from Arrested Development sitcom, holding a cup, opulent home, saying “I mean it’s one banana, Michael. How much could it cost? Ten dollars?”
2nd panel- Michael sitting back, head on hand saying “you’ve never actually stepped foot in a supermarket, have you?”
Oh damn! I watched the show many years ago, but the joke flew straight over my head.
Alright then MS, (this is hypothetical as I haven’t ran Windows as my main OS in years and don’t plan on going back) since you want me to trade in my hardware, how 'bout I trade in your OS instead? :p
Users to microsoft: “You’re creating a huge pile of garbage out of perfectly fine devices because of unneeded hardware requirement”
microsoft: “It’s ok, just buy a new one”
Rarely have a message gone through so bad.
Funny because people still use Windows 7 in large quantities across the world.
Windows 7 is such a nice user experience today, if you use it in 2025 you really get an idea of how far windows has fallen off.
Can you believe this company has a Chief Sustainability Officer? What the fuck do they do all day?
Yell at the wind
Microsoft is getting billions for AI datacenters (they’re now turning back on) why do you buy me a fucking new PC Microsoft
Why have 1bil when you could have 1.1 bil
